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Explore the complex relationship between measurement, value, and governance in this thought-provoking podcast episode featuring Paul Smaldino and C. Thi Nguyen. Delve into discussions on value capture, legibility, viewpoint diversity, and challenges faced by large governments. Examine the expert identification problem and its implications for political economies. Gain insights into the Santa Fe Institute's five-year international research collaboration on emergent political economies. Discover how the confusion between maps and territories affects human understanding and behavior, and learn about the limitations of metrics in capturing nuanced concepts like health and fitness. Consider the philosophical conundrums that arise when applying governance at scales beyond human intuition, and reflect on the challenges of practicing social science to inform new approaches to political economy.